Author: "gingy1raylynn" <gingy1@...> Time: Sun Dec 5, 2004 5:05 am PST Link
Hello all,
I am curious how devoted to COMPLETE deburring of parts the rest of
you are. I am currently working on the HS, and I must say, deburring
ribs must be my least favorite job. But this may be because I'm just
going overboard. My main sticking point is deburring the relief
notches in the nose ribs, and the eight inboard inspar ribs. I spoke
to a -6A builder, and he said he hit the edges of the ribs, but
didn't worry with the notches. I am going so far, I am beveling the
edges even in these notches. What have you guys done? To me, this
seems like overkill, and is a BIG time destroyer....
Thanks,
Eric
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Author: "Schmo" <schmoboy@...> Time: Sun Dec 5, 2004 9:47 am PST Link
I just deburr the edges.
- Sean #303
_____
From: gingy1raylynn [mailto:gingy1@bellsouth.net]
Sent: Sunday, December 05, 2004 5:57 AM
To: RV10@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [RV10] Deburring, How rigorous must I be?!
Hello all,
I am curious how devoted to COMPLETE deburring of parts the rest of
you are. I am currently working on the HS, and I must say, deburring
ribs must be my least favorite job. But this may be because I'm just
going overboard. My main sticking point is deburring the relief
notches in the nose ribs, and the eight inboard inspar ribs. I spoke
to a -6A builder, and he said he hit the edges of the ribs, but
didn't worry with the notches. I am going so far, I am beveling the
edges even in these notches. What have you guys done? To me, this
seems like overkill, and is a BIG time destroyer....
Thanks,
Eric
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Author: Tim Olson <tim@...> Time: Sun Dec 5, 2004 9:47 am PST Link
In the archives, you'll find a post VERY similar to yours that I wrote
back when I was doing the VS and HS. I was going completely insane
with deburring. I'd file down the cutting marks in those relief
notches, hit the curved inner end with a round file, then scotchbrite
the notches, until the edges were shiny and mirror like, just like the
long edges done on the deburring wheel. After reading van's manual
about relieving stress, and worrying about cracking, I was going way
overboard. So I posted here, and called vans.
I basically got the reply that when you look at the parts we're getting
from Van's, they're probably already better than what the major
manufacturers like Cessna would stick in their planes. And, some
huge percentage of people don't even deburr all of those places. So,
I eased up, and the further through the kit I got, the more I got
sensible.
I was easily taking 30-45 minutes PER RIB SECTION on the HS. Van's said
they'd have the whole thing done in some short time (I can't remember
if they said 30 minutes or 2 hours). Anyway, I was on track to spend
probably 30 HOURS the way I was going.
You really need to look at what you're deburring. Spars, definitely
deburr well, even the lightening holes. Skins, deburr as you feel
necessary, but I'd always deburr all holes, and edges I'd at least
get rid of major nicks. I'm now using 2" scotchbrite wheels on a
die grinder, but I found a sanding block also works well, followed
by one of those 'V' shaped deburring handheld tools. For those
stinkin ribs, here's how mine go. I bought an extra deburring wheel
so my grinder has one on each side. This way I have plety of sharp
corners on the wheel. I just do all of the long flats real well
on those little ribs. I also then just kind of bevel inward the
relieve notches....but Don't hit them more than just a sec, or you'll
thin them and cause exactly what you're trying to prevent. Just
a quick skim. On nose ribs, I quickly run the round of the nose
around the wheel between notches too, just so there isn't any sharp
edge pushing on the skins.
A couple of areas to be careful:
On the VS, those nose ribs are probably a bit long on the front. My
middle nose rib didn't want to go into the skin well....and ended up
denting the skin. There's no problem with shortening that first
tab of the nose rib by 1/8" or whatever to make it fit better. This
also works for the HS nose ribs. Also, there's a specific rib
down towards the bottom of the VS if I remember right. It's a thicker
piece that gets some real sharp bend, and many if not most members
who inspected carefully found that a tiny crack had started. I used
a round file to make sure the crack didn't spread if possible.
There are TONS of ribs in the wing. Even the big ones only take
me about 1-2 minutes now. That kind of shows how things have
changed for me. And, when I'm all done, the work still to me looks
just as good. Take the time to *think* about the parts....what
kind of stresses are on it? Skins are thin and crack easily. Some
other things don't. Structural spars I'd be careful with. But,
although those relief notches are a place where a rib could crack
easily, the stresses that wing is put under are probably not likely
to crack it now that there is at least a relief notch there.
Hope that helps.
--
Tim Olson -- RV-10 #170
Tim@MyRV10.com
Wing Kit - Working on the Flaps
'77 Sundowner - For Sale
gingy1raylynn wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> I am curious how devoted to COMPLETE deburring of parts the rest of
> you are. I am currently working on the HS, and I must say, deburring
> ribs must be my least favorite job. But this may be because I'm just
> going overboard. My main sticking point is deburring the relief
> notches in the nose ribs, and the eight inboard inspar ribs. I spoke
> to a -6A builder, and he said he hit the edges of the ribs, but
> didn't worry with the notches. I am going so far, I am beveling the
> edges even in these notches. What have you guys done? To me, this
> seems like overkill, and is a BIG time destroyer....
> Thanks,
> Eric
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Author: "sfdarton" <sfdarton@...> Time: Sun Dec 5, 2004 9:48 am PST Link
Eric,
I have been deburring between the tabs or any other notch on mainly
the outside surface of the ribs that could scratch the inside of the
skin. I found that I could do this fairly quik and easy on the scotch
deburring wheel. I keep one edge of the wheel at a fairly sharp 90 so
it will fit into the cutout between the tabs. Rock it back and forth
in the end of the slot then quickly roll the rib so that the corner
of the wheel runs quickly down the slot. It should only take 5
seconds or less per slot. Start ou wit a small piece like your HS
nose rib, it is really fairly easy. Also I would highly recomend
using a Cogsdill burraway tool to deburr all of your holes. It works
very quickly and deburrs both sides of the hole in one pass! There
was som discussion on this forum as to how long the tool would last.
I have used the same tool for all of the parts in the HS, Elevators
and about halfway through the tail cone. It is still working as well
as it did the first time I used it.
Steve
--- In RV10@yahoogroups.com, "gingy1raylynn" <gingy1@b...> wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> I am curious how devoted to COMPLETE deburring of parts the rest of
> you are. I am currently working on the HS, and I must say,
deburring
> ribs must be my least favorite job. But this may be because I'm
just
> going overboard. My main sticking point is deburring the relief
> notches in the nose ribs, and the eight inboard inspar ribs. I
spoke
> to a -6A builder, and he said he hit the edges of the ribs, but
> didn't worry with the notches. I am going so far, I am beveling
the
> edges even in these notches. What have you guys done? To me, this
> seems like overkill, and is a BIG time destroyer....
> Thanks,
> Eric
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Author: "bob.kaufmann" <bob.kaufmann@...> Time: Sun Dec 5, 2004 12:55 pm PST Link
Deburr, I think that's the thing under the saddle on the old horse.
Bob K
_____
From: sfdarton [mailto:sfdarton@yahoo.com]
Sent: Sunday, December 05, 2004 9:23 AM
To: RV10@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [RV10] Re: Deburring, How rigorous must I be?!
Eric,
I have been deburring between the tabs or any other notch on mainly
the outside surface of the ribs that could scratch the inside of the
skin. I found that I could do this fairly quik and easy on the scotch
deburring wheel. I keep one edge of the wheel at a fairly sharp 90 so
it will fit into the cutout between the tabs. Rock it back and forth
in the end of the slot then quickly roll the rib so that the corner
of the wheel runs quickly down the slot. It should only take 5
seconds or less per slot. Start ou wit a small piece like your HS
nose rib, it is really fairly easy. Also I would highly recomend
using a Cogsdill burraway tool to deburr all of your holes. It works
very quickly and deburrs both sides of the hole in one pass! There
was som discussion on this forum as to how long the tool would last.
I have used the same tool for all of the parts in the HS, Elevators
and about halfway through the tail cone. It is still working as well
as it did the first time I used it.
Steve
--- In RV10@yahoogroups.com, "gingy1raylynn" <gingy1@b...> wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> I am curious how devoted to COMPLETE deburring of parts the rest of
> you are. I am currently working on the HS, and I must say,
deburring
> ribs must be my least favorite job. But this may be because I'm
just
> going overboard. My main sticking point is deburring the relief
> notches in the nose ribs, and the eight inboard inspar ribs. I
spoke
> to a -6A builder, and he said he hit the edges of the ribs, but
> didn't worry with the notches. I am going so far, I am beveling
the
> edges even in these notches. What have you guys done? To me, this
> seems like overkill, and is a BIG time destroyer....
> Thanks,
> Eric
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Author: "microsmurfer" <microsmurfer@...> Time: Sun Dec 5, 2004 12:56 pm PST Link
One thing that can be used on lightening holes is the Dremel tool
with appropriate attachment ("Dremel 500 abrasive wheel"). Works
perfect and you're done in a minute or less.. the wheel is smaller,
so you can get into these smaller lightening holes as well...
works for most all edges.... even for rivet holes too :)
Radomir
-7A
--- In RV10@yahoogroups.com, Tim Olson <tim@M...> wrote:
>
> In the archives, you'll find a post VERY similar to yours that I
wrote
> back when I was doing the VS and HS. I was going completely insane
> with deburring. I'd file down the cutting marks in those relief
> notches, hit the curved inner end with a round file, then
scotchbrite
> the notches, until the edges were shiny and mirror like, just like
the
> long edges done on the deburring wheel. After reading van's manual
> about relieving stress, and worrying about cracking, I was going
way
> overboard. So I posted here, and called vans.
>
> I basically got the reply that when you look at the parts we're
getting
> from Van's, they're probably already better than what the major
> manufacturers like Cessna would stick in their planes. And, some
> huge percentage of people don't even deburr all of those places.
So,
> I eased up, and the further through the kit I got, the more I got
> sensible.
>
> I was easily taking 30-45 minutes PER RIB SECTION on the HS.
Van's said
> they'd have the whole thing done in some short time (I can't
remember
> if they said 30 minutes or 2 hours). Anyway, I was on track to
spend
> probably 30 HOURS the way I was going.
>
> You really need to look at what you're deburring. Spars,
definitely
> deburr well, even the lightening holes. Skins, deburr as you feel
> necessary, but I'd always deburr all holes, and edges I'd at least
> get rid of major nicks. I'm now using 2" scotchbrite wheels on a
> die grinder, but I found a sanding block also works well, followed
> by one of those 'V' shaped deburring handheld tools. For those
> stinkin ribs, here's how mine go. I bought an extra deburring
wheel
> so my grinder has one on each side. This way I have plety of sharp
> corners on the wheel. I just do all of the long flats real well
> on those little ribs. I also then just kind of bevel inward the
> relieve notches....but Don't hit them more than just a sec, or
you'll
> thin them and cause exactly what you're trying to prevent. Just
> a quick skim. On nose ribs, I quickly run the round of the nose
> around the wheel between notches too, just so there isn't any sharp
> edge pushing on the skins.
>
> A couple of areas to be careful:
> On the VS, those nose ribs are probably a bit long on the front.
My
> middle nose rib didn't want to go into the skin well....and ended
up
> denting the skin. There's no problem with shortening that first
> tab of the nose rib by 1/8" or whatever to make it fit better.
This
> also works for the HS nose ribs. Also, there's a specific rib
> down towards the bottom of the VS if I remember right. It's a
thicker
> piece that gets some real sharp bend, and many if not most members
> who inspected carefully found that a tiny crack had started. I
used
> a round file to make sure the crack didn't spread if possible.
>
> There are TONS of ribs in the wing. Even the big ones only take
> me about 1-2 minutes now. That kind of shows how things have
> changed for me. And, when I'm all done, the work still to me looks
> just as good. Take the time to *think* about the parts....what
> kind of stresses are on it? Skins are thin and crack easily. Some
> other things don't. Structural spars I'd be careful with. But,
> although those relief notches are a place where a rib could crack
> easily, the stresses that wing is put under are probably not likely
> to crack it now that there is at least a relief notch there.
>
> Hope that helps.
>
> --
> Tim Olson -- RV-10 #170
> Tim@M...
> Wing Kit - Working on the Flaps
> '77 Sundowner - For Sale
> gingy1raylynn wrote:
> > Hello all,
> >
> > I am curious how devoted to COMPLETE deburring of parts the rest
of
> > you are. I am currently working on the HS, and I must say,
deburring
> > ribs must be my least favorite job. But this may be because I'm
just
> > going overboard. My main sticking point is deburring the relief
> > notches in the nose ribs, and the eight inboard inspar ribs. I
spoke
> > to a -6A builder, and he said he hit the edges of the ribs, but
> > didn't worry with the notches. I am going so far, I am beveling
the
> > edges even in these notches. What have you guys done? To me,
this
> > seems like overkill, and is a BIG time destroyer....
> > Thanks,
> > Eric
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Author: "JOHN STARN" <jhstarn@...> Time: Sun Dec 5, 2004 2:44 pm PST Link
NAH....deburr is what happens after you to return to the house at 5am newspaper dash in the High Desert lately. 28 degrees with 15MPH wind. BURRRRRR. 8*) KABONG
----- Original Message -----
From: bob.kaufmann
To: RV10@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, December 05, 2004 10:25 AM
Subject: RE: [RV10] Re: Deburring, How rigorous must I be?!
Deburr, I think that's the thing under the saddle on the old horse.
Bob K
_____
From: sfdarton [mailto:sfdarton@yahoo.com]
Sent: Sunday, December 05, 2004 9:23 AM
To: RV10@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [RV10] Re: Deburring, How rigorous must I be?!
Eric,
I have been deburring between the tabs or any other notch on mainly
the outside surface of the ribs that could scratch the inside of the
skin. I found that I could do this fairly quik and easy on the scotch
deburring wheel. I keep one edge of the wheel at a fairly sharp 90 so
it will fit into the cutout between the tabs. Rock it back and forth
in the end of the slot then quickly roll the rib so that the corner
of the wheel runs quickly down the slot. It should only take 5
seconds or less per slot. Start ou wit a small piece like your HS
nose rib, it is really fairly easy. Also I would highly recomend
using a Cogsdill burraway tool to deburr all of your holes. It works
very quickly and deburrs both sides of the hole in one pass! There
was som discussion on this forum as to how long the tool would last.
I have used the same tool for all of the parts in the HS, Elevators
and about halfway through the tail cone. It is still working as well
as it did the first time I used it.
Steve
--- In RV10@yahoogroups.com, "gingy1raylynn" <gingy1@b...> wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> I am curious how devoted to COMPLETE deburring of parts the rest of
> you are. I am currently working on the HS, and I must say,
deburring
> ribs must be my least favorite job. But this may be because I'm
just
> going overboard. My main sticking point is deburring the relief
> notches in the nose ribs, and the eight inboard inspar ribs. I
spoke
> to a -6A builder, and he said he hit the edges of the ribs, but
> didn't worry with the notches. I am going so far, I am beveling
the
> edges even in these notches. What have you guys done? To me, this
> seems like overkill, and is a BIG time destroyer....
> Thanks,
> Eric
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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Author: n213rv@... Time: Sun Dec 5, 2004 3:45 pm PST Link
I'm on my 3rd RV, and I debur each notch with a file.... Typically I sit
down in the living room on Saturday and Sunday with football on the TV and file
away.... I does take long, but sharp corners and vibration = cracks. I
don't care how 'important' the part seems or does not seem, they are all there
for structure. A crack on a rib will be much harder to replace later in life
than to do properly from the beginning.
Yes it takes a lot of time, but you are building an airplane, not a car.....
-Mike Kraus
RV-4, RV-7, now building an RV-10 and hate filing.....
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Author: "Dave" <skatetrainer@...> Time: Sun Dec 5, 2004 6:14 pm PST Link
File it is on all the edges and then 400 sandpaper. Although I do
use a Burraway and that is a slick tool.
More primer wars but FYI only. I've been using a spray can self
etching - from the auto parts store. It scratches very easily. I
found a painter at work that uses "Steel Coat" industrial primer on
all metal parts and swears by it. Comes in gallon cans. Clear.
Just degrease and spray. Dries in minutes. I tried it on some ribs
and he was right. It does seem to work well. Almost impossible to
scratch off.
Anyone heard of this product?
--- In RV10@yahoogroups.com, n213rv@a... wrote:
>
> I'm on my 3rd RV, and I debur each notch with a file.... Typically
I sit
> down in the living room on Saturday and Sunday with football on
the TV and file
> away.... I does take long, but sharp corners and vibration =
cracks. I
> don't care how 'important' the part seems or does not seem, they
are all there
> for structure. A crack on a rib will be much harder to replace
later in life
> than to do properly from the beginning.
>
> Yes it takes a lot of time, but you are building an airplane, not
a car.....
>
> -Mike Kraus
> RV-4, RV-7, now building an RV-10 and hate filing.....
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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