Author: "lindbergs52" <lindbergs1@...> Time: Tue Jul 5, 2005 12:39 am PDT Link
Just finished rigging the flaps. Total travel is 45 degrees, the manual specifies 40 degrees.
How does it fly with the flaps down 45? Has anyone installed a limiter switch or a physical
stop? Seems like a lot of extra work. I'm inclined to let them go down to 45. Comments?
Steve.
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Author: "Dan Checkoway" <dan@...> Time: Tue Jul 5, 2005 2:01 am PDT Link
Mine flies fine so far with something like 46 degrees of full flap
deflection.
I originally intended to install a limit switch for down travel, which would
certainly do the trick. But I basically figured...fly the plane, see how it
behaves with flaps "over-extended" like that, and then make a decision based
on flight characteristics. In the end I decided to keep the extra
deflection.
The difference is barely noticeable in flight. I'm able to make incredibly
steep power-off descents. In the flare I don't really feel a difference
once speed bleeds off. There is a difference, however, practically speaking
in terms of how close to the wing you can stand when loading & unloading,
entering & egressing.
Let Van's be the authority on this, but I wouldn't hesitate at least to give
it a try in the air as-is.
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D (544 hours)
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "lindbergs52" <lindbergs1@comcast.net>
To: <RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 11:52 PM
Subject: [RV7Yahoo] flap travel
> Just finished rigging the flaps. Total travel is 45 degrees, the manual
specifies 40 degrees.
> How does it fly with the flaps down 45? Has anyone installed a limiter
switch or a physical
> stop? Seems like a lot of extra work. I'm inclined to let them go down
to 45. Comments?
> Steve.
> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> www.vansaircraft.net
> Yahoo! Groups Links
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Author: "Hicks" <hicksco@...> Time: Tue Jul 5, 2005 4:47 pm PDT Link
Dan,
Did you do any testing to see if the lower flap angle (45*-46*), lowered the final stall speed any at all?
It seems to me that it would have some effect though maybe small. Perhaps lowering the stall speed 2 or 3 mph.
Carson
----- Original Message -----
From: Dan Checkoway
To: RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 3:30 AM
Subject: Re: [RV7Yahoo] flap travel
Mine flies fine so far with something like 46 degrees of full flap
deflection.
I originally intended to install a limit switch for down travel, which would
certainly do the trick. But I basically figured...fly the plane, see how it
behaves with flaps "over-extended" like that, and then make a decision based
on flight characteristics. In the end I decided to keep the extra
deflection.
The difference is barely noticeable in flight. I'm able to make incredibly
steep power-off descents. In the flare I don't really feel a difference
once speed bleeds off. There is a difference, however, practically speaking
in terms of how close to the wing you can stand when loading & unloading,
entering & egressing.
Let Van's be the authority on this, but I wouldn't hesitate at least to give
it a try in the air as-is.
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D (544 hours)
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "lindbergs52" <lindbergs1@comcast.net>
To: <RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 11:52 PM
Subject: [RV7Yahoo] flap travel
> Just finished rigging the flaps. Total travel is 45 degrees, the manual
specifies 40 degrees.
> How does it fly with the flaps down 45? Has anyone installed a limiter
switch or a physical
> stop? Seems like a lot of extra work. I'm inclined to let them go down
to 45. Comments?
> Steve.
> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> www.vansaircraft.net
> Yahoo! Groups Links
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
a.. Visit your group "RV7and7A" on the web.
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Author: "Dan Checkoway" <dan@...> Time: Tue Jul 5, 2005 6:44 pm PDT Link
I haven't done that yet...good idea. If I hadn't just landed I would go out
and test it now. I'll be flying again tomorrow and I'll try to remember to
do a stall speed test with full flaps and with a visually estimated 40*.
I'd be surprised if it makes a noticeable difference in stall speed, but
we'll see!!
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hicks" <hicksco@cox.net>
To: <RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 9:25 AM
Subject: Re: [RV7Yahoo] flap travel
> Dan,
> Did you do any testing to see if the lower flap angle (45*-46*), lowered
the final stall speed any at all?
> It seems to me that it would have some effect though maybe small. Perhaps
lowering the stall speed 2 or 3 mph.
> Carson
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Dan Checkoway
> To: RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 3:30 AM
> Subject: Re: [RV7Yahoo] flap travel
> Mine flies fine so far with something like 46 degrees of full flap
> deflection.
>
> I originally intended to install a limit switch for down travel, which
would
> certainly do the trick. But I basically figured...fly the plane, see
how it
> behaves with flaps "over-extended" like that, and then make a decision
based
> on flight characteristics. In the end I decided to keep the extra
> deflection.
>
> The difference is barely noticeable in flight. I'm able to make
incredibly
> steep power-off descents. In the flare I don't really feel a difference
> once speed bleeds off. There is a difference, however, practically
speaking
> in terms of how close to the wing you can stand when loading &
unloading,
> entering & egressing.
>
> Let Van's be the authority on this, but I wouldn't hesitate at least to
give
> it a try in the air as-is.
>
> )_( Dan
> RV-7 N714D (544 hours)
> http://www.rvproject.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "lindbergs52" <lindbergs1@comcast.net>
> To: <RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 11:52 PM
> Subject: [RV7Yahoo] flap travel
> > Just finished rigging the flaps. Total travel is 45 degrees, the
manual
> specifies 40 degrees.
> > How does it fly with the flaps down 45? Has anyone installed a
limiter
> switch or a physical
> > stop? Seems like a lot of extra work. I'm inclined to let them go
down
> to 45. Comments?
> > Steve.
> > Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> > www.vansaircraft.net
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> www.vansaircraft.net
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
> YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
>
> a.. Visit your group "RV7and7A" on the web.
>
> b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> www.vansaircraft.net
> Yahoo! Groups Links
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Author: "lindbergs52" <lindbergs1@...> Time: Tue Jul 5, 2005 9:38 pm PDT Link
Thanks for the reply, guys. If I do anything it will probably be limited to putting a black
line on the left flap leading edge to mark 40 degrees of travel. I suspect the extra 5
degrees will only add more drag and have no measurable effect on the stall speed. It
appears from Dan's comments that the extra drag is not objectionable. My concern would
be for less experieced pilots letting the airplane get too slow on final and getting into a
high sink rate situation. Further comments? Steve.
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Author: Michèle Delsol <michele.delsol@...> Time: Wed Jul 6, 2005 9:15 am PDT Link
Just guessing but you are probably not going to change the stall speed
however you might significantly increase the drag and thus the sink rate –
this means that you might need more power on short final. But the other
issue is stresses on the flap hinge and tubing which transmits the efforts
to the flap actuating mechanism. On the hinge side, judging from what I have
seen on other planes, I feel comfortable with the Vans solution. On the
actuating side, Van’s calls for a small diameter aluminum tube. There was a
discussion on this a while back – forget which list – but several, including
myself, felt that the AL tubing seemed a little flimsy and have decided to
replace them with equivalent 4130 steel tubes (got them at Wicks I believe).
Furthermore, Van’s calls for tapping the inside of the Al tube. I’d feel
more comfortable with a tap on steel. FWIW. Yea, I know, more weight – but
any of you have tried to control a plane with one flap down and the other
one flapping away with the wind?
Michele Delsol
RV8 Fuselage
_____
From: RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of lindbergs52
Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 5:45 AM
To: RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [RV7Yahoo] flap travel
Thanks for the reply, guys. If I do anything it will probably be limited to
putting a black
line on the left flap leading edge to mark 40 degrees of travel. I suspect
the extra 5
degrees will only add more drag and have no measurable effect on the stall
speed. It
appears from Dan's comments that the extra drag is not objectionable. My
concern would
be for less experieced pilots letting the airplane get too slow on final and
getting into a
high sink rate situation. Further comments? Steve.
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
_____
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
* Visit your group "RV7and7A <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A>
" on the web.
* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>
* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service.
_____
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Author: Walter Tondu <walter@...> Time: Wed Jul 6, 2005 11:07 pm PDT Link
On 07/06 11:25, Michèle Delsol wrote:
> discussion on this a while back forget which list but several, including
> myself, felt that the AL tubing seemed a little flimsy and have decided to
> replace them with equivalent 4130 steel tubes (got them at Wicks I believe).
> Furthermore, Van's calls for tapping the inside of the Al tube. I'd feel
> more comfortable with a tap on steel. FWIW. Yea, I know, more weight but
> any of you have tried to control a plane with one flap down and the other
> one flapping away with the wind?
A few weeks back I was looking over Mike Holland's plane (9A)
with Dan C. and he noticed that the 9's have a hexagonal aluminum
tube (in cross section) instead of round tubing for the pushrod
in the 7's. It's lighter than steel and it's not going to bend.
You still have the issue of tapping aluminum though. Don't know
why Van's decided not to go with the Hex tubing on the 7's...
--
Walter Tondu
http://www.rv7-a.com
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Author: "Mark Olson" <molson1@...> Time: Thu Jul 7, 2005 7:50 am PDT Link
Maybe it's not an issue because it's always under compression? I'd be more
concerned about the threaded aluminum if there were tension stress on the
part but it seems to me that the wind loads are always going to be keeping
it compressed. It's fairly thick aluminum as well. We just got done
mounting the flaps and it seems pretty robust.
The only issue I've ever seen with this part was a plane where it rubbed
against the fuselage and eventually broke because it wore through, causing
asymmetrical flap deployment. We made damn sure ours doesn't rub and I
don't think we have much to worry about.
Mark Olson
N407V
> -----Original Message-----
> From: RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com]On
> Behalf Of Walter Tondu
> Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 11:29 AM
> To: RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [RV7Yahoo] flap travel
> On 07/06 11:25, Michèle Delsol wrote:
>
> > discussion on this a while back forget which list but several,
> including
> > myself, felt that the AL tubing seemed a little flimsy and
> have decided to
> > replace them with equivalent 4130 steel tubes (got them at
> Wicks I believe).
> > Furthermore, Van's calls for tapping the inside of the Al
> tube. I'd feel
> > more comfortable with a tap on steel. FWIW. Yea, I know, more
> weight but
> > any of you have tried to control a plane with one flap down
> and the other
> > one flapping away with the wind?
>
> A few weeks back I was looking over Mike Holland's plane (9A)
> with Dan C. and he noticed that the 9's have a hexagonal aluminum
> tube (in cross section) instead of round tubing for the pushrod
> in the 7's. It's lighter than steel and it's not going to bend.
> You still have the issue of tapping aluminum though. Don't know
> why Van's decided not to go with the Hex tubing on the 7's...
>
> --
> Walter Tondu
> http://www.rv7-a.com
> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> www.vansaircraft.net
> Yahoo! Groups Links
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Author: "Daryl Tolliver" <daryl.tolliver@...> Time: Thu Jul 7, 2005 11:47 pm PDT Link
I talked to a guy this weekend that had the nut come loose and the flap
deployed asymmetrical. He now has that on his walkaround checklist.
Daryl Tolliver
7A Fuselage
_____
From: Mark Olson [mailto:molson1@mn.rr.com]
Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2005 1:21 AM
To: RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [RV7Yahoo] flap travel
Maybe it's not an issue because it's always under compression? I'd be more
concerned about the threaded aluminum if there were tension stress on the
part but it seems to me that the wind loads are always going to be keeping
it compressed. It's fairly thick aluminum as well. We just got done
mounting the flaps and it seems pretty robust.
The only issue I've ever seen with this part was a plane where it rubbed
against the fuselage and eventually broke because it wore through, causing
asymmetrical flap deployment. We made damn sure ours doesn't rub and I
don't think we have much to worry about.
Mark Olson
N407V
> -----Original Message-----
> From: RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com]On
> Behalf Of Walter Tondu
> Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 11:29 AM
> To: RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [RV7Yahoo] flap travel
> On 07/06 11:25, Michèle Delsol wrote:
>
> > discussion on this a while back forget which list but several,
> including
> > myself, felt that the AL tubing seemed a little flimsy and
> have decided to
> > replace them with equivalent 4130 steel tubes (got them at
> Wicks I believe).
> > Furthermore, Van's calls for tapping the inside of the Al
> tube. I'd feel
> > more comfortable with a tap on steel. FWIW. Yea, I know, more
> weight but
> > any of you have tried to control a plane with one flap down
> and the other
> > one flapping away with the wind?
>
> A few weeks back I was looking over Mike Holland's plane (9A)
> with Dan C. and he noticed that the 9's have a hexagonal aluminum
> tube (in cross section) instead of round tubing for the pushrod
> in the 7's. It's lighter than steel and it's not going to bend.
> You still have the issue of tapping aluminum though. Don't know
> why Van's decided not to go with the Hex tubing on the 7's...
>
> --
> Walter Tondu
> http://www.rv7-a.com
> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> www.vansaircraft.net
> Yahoo! Groups Links
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
_____
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
* Visit your group "RV7and7A <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A>
" on the web.
* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe
* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
_____
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/