Author: "dhmilliken" <dhmilliken@...> Time: Sun Jul 10, 2005 5:23 pm PDT Link
Well it had to happen sooner or later! After obsessing and drilling
the elevator horns center pivot bolts to 1/4", my build team
proceeded to drill the rod end attach holes out to 1/4" as well,
instead of the 3/16" called for. Well, actually just one horn, before
the mistake was caught. At this point the decision is to 1) Replace
the elevator horn assembly and redrill to proper size 2) Weld shut the
hole and redrill or 3) Replace the MD3616 rod end with the 1/4" version
of the same rod end (MD4616 I believe). Seems like the edge distance
loss from the hole to the bottom & front would be negligable (-1/32")
but then I'm not an engineer and don't like guessing on these things.
I'll give Vans a call tomorrow but I'm wondering what the group
concensus would be. Press with the 1/4" attachment hardware or rework
to the design 3/16" by replacement or welding & re-drilling the horn.
Thoughts, comments or ideas?
Thanks,
Dave Milliken
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
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Author: Phil Birkelbach <phil@...> Time: Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:27 pm PDT Link
I'd go with the 1/4" rod end. The edge distance probably doesn't
matter since the horn is a steel part and not aluminum.. There would
still be an edge distance requirement but it won't be as stringent as
an aluminum part. Talk to Van's and double check me on this but I
had the same question on another steel part and that is what I was told.
I bet your not the first person to call Van's with that problem
either. Let the group know what you find out.
Godspeed,
Phil
On Jul 10, 2005, at 18:58, dhmilliken wrote:
> Well it had to happen sooner or later! After obsessing and drilling
> the elevator horns center pivot bolts to 1/4", my build team
> proceeded to drill the rod end attach holes out to 1/4" as well,
> instead of the 3/16" called for. Well, actually just one horn, before
> the mistake was caught. At this point the decision is to 1) Replace
> the elevator horn assembly and redrill to proper size 2) Weld shut the
> hole and redrill or 3) Replace the MD3616 rod end with the 1/4"
> version
> of the same rod end (MD4616 I believe). Seems like the edge distance
> loss from the hole to the bottom & front would be negligable (-1/32")
> but then I'm not an engineer and don't like guessing on these things.
> I'll give Vans a call tomorrow but I'm wondering what the group
> concensus would be. Press with the 1/4" attachment hardware or rework
> to the design 3/16" by replacement or welding & re-drilling the horn.
>
> Thoughts, comments or ideas?
> Thanks,
> Dave Milliken
> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> www.vansaircraft.net
> Yahoo! Groups Links
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
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Author: Peter Schwarzenbach <schwarzp@...> Time: Mon Jul 11, 2005 8:07 am PDT Link
Dave,
I misdrilled one of my horns (I just messed up and
missed the right spot!), and I took it and had it
welded shut, ground it flat and then redrilled it.
Not a problem. (I just made sure I primed and then
painted the horn... I used a very similar color and
you really can't tell the difference now.)
Peter Schwarzenbach
RV-7 Fuse
BVY
--- dhmilliken <dhmilliken@aol.com> wrote:
> Well it had to happen sooner or later! After
> obsessing and drilling
> the elevator horns center pivot bolts to 1/4", my
> build team
> proceeded to drill the rod end attach holes out to
> 1/4" as well,
> instead of the 3/16" called for. Well, actually
> just one horn, before
> the mistake was caught. At this point the decision
> is to 1) Replace
> the elevator horn assembly and redrill to proper
> size 2) Weld shut the
> hole and redrill or 3) Replace the MD3616 rod end
> with the 1/4" version
> of the same rod end (MD4616 I believe). Seems like
> the edge distance
> loss from the hole to the bottom & front would be
> negligable (-1/32")
> but then I'm not an engineer and don't like guessing
> on these things.
> I'll give Vans a call tomorrow but I'm wondering
> what the group
> concensus would be. Press with the 1/4" attachment
> hardware or rework
> to the design 3/16" by replacement or welding &
> re-drilling the horn.
>
> Thoughts, comments or ideas?
> Thanks,
> Dave Milliken
__________________________________
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www.vansaircraft.net
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Author: "dhmilliken" <dhmilliken@...> Time: Mon Jul 11, 2005 8:56 pm PDT Link
Here's Vans response...
>>I don't see a problem with drilling the horns to 1/4. The reduced
edge distance would not be a factor; the loads are not that great,
and the material is steel, so ed is not so much of an issue as on
thin
sheet aluminum. Alternatively, you could obviously weld up the hole,
or rivet a patch over the hole to reduce it back down to the 3/16.
Replacing the horn is a big job on a completed elevator, I would not
consider that.
Vans<<
I'm maybe not too big on the idea of riveting a "patch". Welding up
the hole, maybe a better idea. One idea not previously considered is
an interference fit bushing so I can retain the origional rod end and
hardware. A machinist friend may be able to set me up with a hat
bushing that will fill the gap on the horn and substitute for the
washer under the nut for the pushrod connect bolt. Based on Vans
reply, I'll bet they would be good with this fix as well. I think
I'll sit with this one for awhile and work other issues for a bit.
Amazingly enough, A/C Spruce's price on a 1/4" rod end
exceeds the cost of a replacment elevator horn from Vans! I'm glad
Vans didn't recommend replacing that. I'm remembering this as one of
the 1st pieces that I picked up and riveted when I built the elevator.
Dave
--- In RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com, Phil Birkelbach <phil@p...> wrote:
> I'd go with the 1/4" rod end. The edge distance probably doesn't
> matter since the horn is a steel part and not aluminum.. There
would
> still be an edge distance requirement but it won't be as stringent
as
> an aluminum part. Talk to Van's and double check me on this but I
> had the same question on another steel part and that is what I was
told.
>
> I bet your not the first person to call Van's with that problem
> either. Let the group know what you find out.
>
> Godspeed,
>
> Phil
> On Jul 10, 2005, at 18:58, dhmilliken wrote:
>
> > Well it had to happen sooner or later! After obsessing and
drilling
> > the elevator horns center pivot bolts to 1/4", my build team
> > proceeded to drill the rod end attach holes out to 1/4" as well,
> > instead of the 3/16" called for. Well, actually just one horn,
before
> > the mistake was caught. At this point the decision is to 1)
Replace
> > the elevator horn assembly and redrill to proper size 2) Weld
shut the
> > hole and redrill or 3) Replace the MD3616 rod end with the 1/4"
> > version
> > of the same rod end (MD4616 I believe). Seems like the edge
distance
> > loss from the hole to the bottom & front would be negligable (-
1/32")
> > but then I'm not an engineer and don't like guessing on these
things.
> > I'll give Vans a call tomorrow but I'm wondering what the group
> > concensus would be. Press with the 1/4" attachment hardware or
rework
> > to the design 3/16" by replacement or welding & re-drilling the
horn.
> >
> > Thoughts, comments or ideas?
> > Thanks,
> > Dave Milliken
> > Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> > www.vansaircraft.net
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
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Author: "Dan Checkoway" <dan@...> Time: Tue Jul 12, 2005 12:21 am PDT Link
Dude, Van's said it was OK with the 1/4" hole. Consider the cost of the
1/4" rod end the price for learning the lesson. Just use the 1/4" rod end
like Van's approved of and move on...don't lose any more sleep over this!
You won't even remember this until your first annual condition inspection,
at which point you'll probably say, "Oh yeah! I remember when I was
sweating over that. What a non issue." 8^)
Finish it, fly it, and enjoy!
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D (558 hours)
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "dhmilliken" <dhmilliken@aol.com>
To: <RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 8:12 PM
Subject: Re: [RV7Yahoo] Miss-drilling elevator horns
> Here's Vans response...
>
> >>I don't see a problem with drilling the horns to 1/4. The reduced
> edge distance would not be a factor; the loads are not that great,
> and the material is steel, so ed is not so much of an issue as on
> thin
> sheet aluminum. Alternatively, you could obviously weld up the hole,
> or rivet a patch over the hole to reduce it back down to the 3/16.
> Replacing the horn is a big job on a completed elevator, I would not
> consider that.
> Vans<<
>
> I'm maybe not too big on the idea of riveting a "patch". Welding up
> the hole, maybe a better idea. One idea not previously considered is
> an interference fit bushing so I can retain the origional rod end and
> hardware. A machinist friend may be able to set me up with a hat
> bushing that will fill the gap on the horn and substitute for the
> washer under the nut for the pushrod connect bolt. Based on Vans
> reply, I'll bet they would be good with this fix as well. I think
> I'll sit with this one for awhile and work other issues for a bit.
> Amazingly enough, A/C Spruce's price on a 1/4" rod end
> exceeds the cost of a replacment elevator horn from Vans! I'm glad
> Vans didn't recommend replacing that. I'm remembering this as one of
> the 1st pieces that I picked up and riveted when I built the elevator.
>
> Dave
> --- In RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com, Phil Birkelbach <phil@p...> wrote:
> > I'd go with the 1/4" rod end. The edge distance probably doesn't
> > matter since the horn is a steel part and not aluminum.. There
> would
> > still be an edge distance requirement but it won't be as stringent
> as
> > an aluminum part. Talk to Van's and double check me on this but I
> > had the same question on another steel part and that is what I was
> told.
> >
> > I bet your not the first person to call Van's with that problem
> > either. Let the group know what you find out.
> >
> > Godspeed,
> >
> > Phil
> > On Jul 10, 2005, at 18:58, dhmilliken wrote:
> >
> > > Well it had to happen sooner or later! After obsessing and
> drilling
> > > the elevator horns center pivot bolts to 1/4", my build team
> > > proceeded to drill the rod end attach holes out to 1/4" as well,
> > > instead of the 3/16" called for. Well, actually just one horn,
> before
> > > the mistake was caught. At this point the decision is to 1)
> Replace
> > > the elevator horn assembly and redrill to proper size 2) Weld
> shut the
> > > hole and redrill or 3) Replace the MD3616 rod end with the 1/4"
> > > version
> > > of the same rod end (MD4616 I believe). Seems like the edge
> distance
> > > loss from the hole to the bottom & front would be negligable (-
> 1/32")
> > > but then I'm not an engineer and don't like guessing on these
> things.
> > > I'll give Vans a call tomorrow but I'm wondering what the group
> > > concensus would be. Press with the 1/4" attachment hardware or
> rework
> > > to the design 3/16" by replacement or welding & re-drilling the
> horn.
> > >
> > > Thoughts, comments or ideas?
> > > Thanks,
> > > Dave Milliken
> > > Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> > > www.vansaircraft.net
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> www.vansaircraft.net
> Yahoo! Groups Links
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A/
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Author: Phil Birkelbach <phil@...> Time: Tue Jul 12, 2005 9:35 am PDT Link
I agree with Dan! The simplest solution is generally the best
solution. If you weld it you'll have all kinds of heat and slag near
your pretty new elevator. The step washer would probably work but
remember it's tight in there when you are installing the elevators on
the plane for real and the regular washers are hard enough to get in
there. Besides you can't just buy those at 'Spruce either. Just go
the easy way and be done with it. Drill the 1/4" hole, buy the other
rod-end and don't think about it anymore.
Thanks for posting Van's reply, it'll help someone in the future.
Phil
On Jul 11, 2005, at 23:06, Dan Checkoway wrote:
> Dude, Van's said it was OK with the 1/4" hole. Consider the cost
> of the
> 1/4" rod end the price for learning the lesson. Just use the 1/4"
> rod end
> like Van's approved of and move on...don't lose any more sleep over
> this!
>
> You won't even remember this until your first annual condition
> inspection,
> at which point you'll probably say, "Oh yeah! I remember when I was
> sweating over that. What a non issue." 8^)
>
> Finish it, fly it, and enjoy!
>
> )_( Dan
> RV-7 N714D (558 hours)
> http://www.rvproject.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "dhmilliken" <dhmilliken@aol.com>
> To: <RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 8:12 PM
> Subject: Re: [RV7Yahoo] Miss-drilling elevator horns
>> Here's Vans response...
>>>> I don't see a problem with drilling the horns to 1/4. The reduced
>>>>
>> edge distance would not be a factor; the loads are not that great,
>> and the material is steel, so ed is not so much of an issue as on
>> thin
>> sheet aluminum. Alternatively, you could obviously weld up the hole,
>> or rivet a patch over the hole to reduce it back down to the 3/16.
>> Replacing the horn is a big job on a completed elevator, I would not
>> consider that.
>> Vans<<
>>
>> I'm maybe not too big on the idea of riveting a "patch". Welding up
>> the hole, maybe a better idea. One idea not previously considered is
>> an interference fit bushing so I can retain the origional rod end and
>> hardware. A machinist friend may be able to set me up with a hat
>> bushing that will fill the gap on the horn and substitute for the
>> washer under the nut for the pushrod connect bolt. Based on Vans
>> reply, I'll bet they would be good with this fix as well. I think
>> I'll sit with this one for awhile and work other issues for a bit.
>> Amazingly enough, A/C Spruce's price on a 1/4" rod end
>> exceeds the cost of a replacment elevator horn from Vans! I'm glad
>> Vans didn't recommend replacing that. I'm remembering this as one of
>> the 1st pieces that I picked up and riveted when I built the
>> elevator.
>>
>> Dave
>> --- In RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com, Phil Birkelbach <phil@p...> wrote:
>>
>>> I'd go with the 1/4" rod end. The edge distance probably doesn't
>>> matter since the horn is a steel part and not aluminum.. There
>>>
>> would
>>
>>> still be an edge distance requirement but it won't be as stringent
>>>
>> as
>>
>>> an aluminum part. Talk to Van's and double check me on this but I
>>> had the same question on another steel part and that is what I was
>>>
>> told.
>>> I bet your not the first person to call Van's with that problem
>>> either. Let the group know what you find out.
>>>
>>> Godspeed,
>>>
>>> Phil
>>> On Jul 10, 2005, at 18:58, dhmilliken wrote:
>>>> Well it had to happen sooner or later! After obsessing and
>>>>
>> drilling
>>
>>>> the elevator horns center pivot bolts to 1/4", my build team
>>>> proceeded to drill the rod end attach holes out to 1/4" as well,
>>>> instead of the 3/16" called for. Well, actually just one horn,
>>>>
>> before
>>
>>>> the mistake was caught. At this point the decision is to 1)
>>>>
>> Replace
>>
>>>> the elevator horn assembly and redrill to proper size 2) Weld
>>>>
>> shut the
>>
>>>> hole and redrill or 3) Replace the MD3616 rod end with the 1/4"
>>>> version
>>>> of the same rod end (MD4616 I believe). Seems like the edge
>>>>
>> distance
>>
>>>> loss from the hole to the bottom & front would be negligable (-
>>>>
>> 1/32")
>>
>>>> but then I'm not an engineer and don't like guessing on these
>>>>
>> things.
>>
>>>> I'll give Vans a call tomorrow but I'm wondering what the group
>>>> concensus would be. Press with the 1/4" attachment hardware or
>>>>
>> rework
>>
>>>> to the design 3/16" by replacement or welding & re-drilling the
>>>>
>> horn.
>>>> Thoughts, comments or ideas?
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Dave Milliken
>>>> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
>>>> www.vansaircraft.net
>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
>> www.vansaircraft.net
>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> www.vansaircraft.net
> Yahoo! Groups Links
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A/
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Author: "dhmilliken" <dhmilliken@...> Time: Tue Jul 12, 2005 9:41 pm PDT Link
Yeah, there we go. Thanks guys. I just needed a little reality
check. Next step is to locate one of the buggers since A/C Spruce is
on backorder on both coasts thru the first of next month. Any other
supply houses that might have an MD46-16 rod end in stock, come to
mind?
Dave
--- In RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com, Phil Birkelbach <phil@p...> wrote:
> I agree with Dan! The simplest solution is generally the best
> solution. If you weld it you'll have all kinds of heat and slag
near
> your pretty new elevator. The step washer would probably work but
> remember it's tight in there when you are installing the elevators
on
> the plane for real and the regular washers are hard enough to get
in
> there. Besides you can't just buy those at 'Spruce either. Just
go
> the easy way and be done with it. Drill the 1/4" hole, buy the
other
> rod-end and don't think about it anymore.
>
> Thanks for posting Van's reply, it'll help someone in the future.
>
> Phil
> On Jul 11, 2005, at 23:06, Dan Checkoway wrote:
>
> > Dude, Van's said it was OK with the 1/4" hole. Consider the
cost
> > of the
> > 1/4" rod end the price for learning the lesson. Just use the
1/4"
> > rod end
> > like Van's approved of and move on...don't lose any more sleep
over
> > this!
> >
> > You won't even remember this until your first annual condition
> > inspection,
> > at which point you'll probably say, "Oh yeah! I remember when I
was
> > sweating over that. What a non issue." 8^)
> >
> > Finish it, fly it, and enjoy!
> >
> > )_( Dan
> > RV-7 N714D (558 hours)
> > http://www.rvproject.com
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "dhmilliken" <dhmilliken@a...>
> > To: <RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 8:12 PM
> > Subject: Re: [RV7Yahoo] Miss-drilling elevator horns
> >> Here's Vans response...
> >>>> I don't see a problem with drilling the horns to 1/4. The
reduced
> >>>>
> >> edge distance would not be a factor; the loads are not that
great,
> >> and the material is steel, so ed is not so much of an issue as on
> >> thin
> >> sheet aluminum. Alternatively, you could obviously weld up the
hole,
> >> or rivet a patch over the hole to reduce it back down to the
3/16.
> >> Replacing the horn is a big job on a completed elevator, I would
not
> >> consider that.
> >> Vans<<
> >>
> >> I'm maybe not too big on the idea of riveting a "patch".
Welding up
> >> the hole, maybe a better idea. One idea not previously
considered is
> >> an interference fit bushing so I can retain the origional rod
end and
> >> hardware. A machinist friend may be able to set me up with a hat
> >> bushing that will fill the gap on the horn and substitute for the
> >> washer under the nut for the pushrod connect bolt. Based on Vans
> >> reply, I'll bet they would be good with this fix as well. I
think
> >> I'll sit with this one for awhile and work other issues for a
bit.
> >> Amazingly enough, A/C Spruce's price on a 1/4" rod end
> >> exceeds the cost of a replacment elevator horn from Vans! I'm
glad
> >> Vans didn't recommend replacing that. I'm remembering this as
one of
> >> the 1st pieces that I picked up and riveted when I built the
> >> elevator.
> >>
> >> Dave
> >> --- In RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com, Phil Birkelbach <phil@p...>
wrote:
> >>
> >>> I'd go with the 1/4" rod end. The edge distance probably
doesn't
> >>> matter since the horn is a steel part and not aluminum.. There
> >>>
> >> would
> >>
> >>> still be an edge distance requirement but it won't be as
stringent
> >>>
> >> as
> >>
> >>> an aluminum part. Talk to Van's and double check me on this
but I
> >>> had the same question on another steel part and that is what I
was
> >>>
> >> told.
> >>> I bet your not the first person to call Van's with that problem
> >>> either. Let the group know what you find out.
> >>>
> >>> Godspeed,
> >>>
> >>> Phil
> >>> On Jul 10, 2005, at 18:58, dhmilliken wrote:
> >>>> Well it had to happen sooner or later! After obsessing and
> >>>>
> >> drilling
> >>
> >>>> the elevator horns center pivot bolts to 1/4", my build team
> >>>> proceeded to drill the rod end attach holes out to 1/4" as
well,
> >>>> instead of the 3/16" called for. Well, actually just one horn,
> >>>>
> >> before
> >>
> >>>> the mistake was caught. At this point the decision is to 1)
> >>>>
> >> Replace
> >>
> >>>> the elevator horn assembly and redrill to proper size 2) Weld
> >>>>
> >> shut the
> >>
> >>>> hole and redrill or 3) Replace the MD3616 rod end with the 1/4"
> >>>> version
> >>>> of the same rod end (MD4616 I believe). Seems like the edge
> >>>>
> >> distance
> >>
> >>>> loss from the hole to the bottom & front would be negligable (-
> >>>>
> >> 1/32")
> >>
> >>>> but then I'm not an engineer and don't like guessing on these
> >>>>
> >> things.
> >>
> >>>> I'll give Vans a call tomorrow but I'm wondering what the group
> >>>> concensus would be. Press with the 1/4" attachment hardware or
> >>>>
> >> rework
> >>
> >>>> to the design 3/16" by replacement or welding & re-drilling the
> >>>>
> >> horn.
> >>>> Thoughts, comments or ideas?
> >>>> Thanks,
> >>>> Dave Milliken
> >>>> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> >>>> www.vansaircraft.net
> >>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> >> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> >> www.vansaircraft.net
> >> Yahoo! Groups Links
> > Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> > www.vansaircraft.net
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7and7A/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
RV7and7A-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
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Author: "Dan Checkoway" <dan@...> Time: Tue Jul 12, 2005 11:24 pm PDT Link
Call Genuine Aircraft Hardware Company:
http://www.gen-aircraft-hardware.com They stock all sorts of stuff.
Here's another one:
http://www.aerocraftparts.com/ItemForm.aspx?item=MD46-16MAU
(cheaper than Spruce, I think)
Does Van's have a source? Since they stock the MD36, maybe they can source
the MD46.
Or just get the MD46-15, which Spruce does seem to stock, and use an
additional washer?
Or just wait until Spruce has the right part in stock...not like you'll be
flying within the next few weeks anyway, I assume.
You have options...and probably lots of other stuff to work on in the
meantime. Keep cranking, you'll be done soon!
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D (558 hours)
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "dhmilliken" <dhmilliken@aol.com>
To: <RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 9:12 PM
Subject: Re: [RV7Yahoo] Miss-drilling elevator horns
> Yeah, there we go. Thanks guys. I just needed a little reality
> check. Next step is to locate one of the buggers since A/C Spruce is
> on backorder on both coasts thru the first of next month. Any other
> supply houses that might have an MD46-16 rod end in stock, come to
> mind?
> Dave
> --- In RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com, Phil Birkelbach <phil@p...> wrote:
> > I agree with Dan! The simplest solution is generally the best
> > solution. If you weld it you'll have all kinds of heat and slag
> near
> > your pretty new elevator. The step washer would probably work but
> > remember it's tight in there when you are installing the elevators
> on
> > the plane for real and the regular washers are hard enough to get
> in
> > there. Besides you can't just buy those at 'Spruce either. Just
> go
> > the easy way and be done with it. Drill the 1/4" hole, buy the
> other
> > rod-end and don't think about it anymore.
> >
> > Thanks for posting Van's reply, it'll help someone in the future.
> >
> > Phil
> > On Jul 11, 2005, at 23:06, Dan Checkoway wrote:
> >
> > > Dude, Van's said it was OK with the 1/4" hole. Consider the
> cost
> > > of the
> > > 1/4" rod end the price for learning the lesson. Just use the
> 1/4"
> > > rod end
> > > like Van's approved of and move on...don't lose any more sleep
> over
> > > this!
> > >
> > > You won't even remember this until your first annual condition
> > > inspection,
> > > at which point you'll probably say, "Oh yeah! I remember when I
> was
> > > sweating over that. What a non issue." 8^)
> > >
> > > Finish it, fly it, and enjoy!
> > >
> > > )_( Dan
> > > RV-7 N714D (558 hours)
> > > http://www.rvproject.com
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "dhmilliken" <dhmilliken@a...>
> > > To: <RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com>
> > > Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 8:12 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [RV7Yahoo] Miss-drilling elevator horns
> > >> Here's Vans response...
> > >>>> I don't see a problem with drilling the horns to 1/4. The
> reduced
> > >>>>
> > >> edge distance would not be a factor; the loads are not that
> great,
> > >> and the material is steel, so ed is not so much of an issue as on
> > >> thin
> > >> sheet aluminum. Alternatively, you could obviously weld up the
> hole,
> > >> or rivet a patch over the hole to reduce it back down to the
> 3/16.
> > >> Replacing the horn is a big job on a completed elevator, I would
> not
> > >> consider that.
> > >> Vans<<
> > >>
> > >> I'm maybe not too big on the idea of riveting a "patch".
> Welding up
> > >> the hole, maybe a better idea. One idea not previously
> considered is
> > >> an interference fit bushing so I can retain the origional rod
> end and
> > >> hardware. A machinist friend may be able to set me up with a hat
> > >> bushing that will fill the gap on the horn and substitute for the
> > >> washer under the nut for the pushrod connect bolt. Based on Vans
> > >> reply, I'll bet they would be good with this fix as well. I
> think
> > >> I'll sit with this one for awhile and work other issues for a
> bit.
> > >> Amazingly enough, A/C Spruce's price on a 1/4" rod end
> > >> exceeds the cost of a replacment elevator horn from Vans! I'm
> glad
> > >> Vans didn't recommend replacing that. I'm remembering this as
> one of
> > >> the 1st pieces that I picked up and riveted when I built the
> > >> elevator.
> > >>
> > >> Dave
> > >> --- In RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com, Phil Birkelbach <phil@p...>
> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> I'd go with the 1/4" rod end. The edge distance probably
> doesn't
> > >>> matter since the horn is a steel part and not aluminum.. There
> > >>>
> > >> would
> > >>
> > >>> still be an edge distance requirement but it won't be as
> stringent
> > >>>
> > >> as
> > >>
> > >>> an aluminum part. Talk to Van's and double check me on this
> but I
> > >>> had the same question on another steel part and that is what I
> was
> > >>>
> > >> told.
> > >>> I bet your not the first person to call Van's with that problem
> > >>> either. Let the group know what you find out.
> > >>>
> > >>> Godspeed,
> > >>>
> > >>> Phil
> > >>> On Jul 10, 2005, at 18:58, dhmilliken wrote:
> > >>>> Well it had to happen sooner or later! After obsessing and
> > >>>>
> > >> drilling
> > >>
> > >>>> the elevator horns center pivot bolts to 1/4", my build team
> > >>>> proceeded to drill the rod end attach holes out to 1/4" as
> well,
> > >>>> instead of the 3/16" called for. Well, actually just one horn,
> > >>>>
> > >> before
> > >>
> > >>>> the mistake was caught. At this point the decision is to 1)
> > >>>>
> > >> Replace
> > >>
> > >>>> the elevator horn assembly and redrill to proper size 2) Weld
> > >>>>
> > >> shut the
> > >>
> > >>>> hole and redrill or 3) Replace the MD3616 rod end with the 1/4"
> > >>>> version
> > >>>> of the same rod end (MD4616 I believe). Seems like the edge
> > >>>>
> > >> distance
> > >>
> > >>>> loss from the hole to the bottom & front would be negligable (-
> > >>>>
> > >> 1/32")
> > >>
> > >>>> but then I'm not an engineer and don't like guessing on these
> > >>>>
> > >> things.
> > >>
> > >>>> I'll give Vans a call tomorrow but I'm wondering what the group
> > >>>> concensus would be. Press with the 1/4" attachment hardware or
> > >>>>
> > >> rework
> > >>
> > >>>> to the design 3/16" by replacement or welding & re-drilling the
> > >>>>
> > >> horn.
> > >>>> Thoughts, comments or ideas?
> > >>>> Thanks,
> > >>>> Dave Milliken
> > >>>> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> > >>>> www.vansaircraft.net
> > >>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> > >> www.vansaircraft.net
> > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> > > www.vansaircraft.net
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
> www.vansaircraft.net
> Yahoo! Groups Links
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
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Author: "dhmilliken" <dhmilliken@...> Time: Sat Jul 16, 2005 4:29 pm PDT Link
To finish out the story for future reference by others...
Seems all suppliers are back ordered on the most dimensionally
similar rod end (MD46-16) A/C Spruce has been shifting their
backorder due in date, month to month and is now out to the end of
September. Gen A/C Hardware Co has no due in date at all. I elected
to go with the MD46-15 which physically a bit longer but should still
do the job, just with more threads screwed into the pushrod end cap.
This along with an AN4-14 instead of the AN3-14 bolt completes the
picture. End of story and time to refocus on other areas. Thanks
Dan C. for pointing out the -15 rod end. I didn't even notice that
one before and I think you are correct in that it is probably just
about one washer difference in width from the -16 rod end. We'll see.
Dave Milliken
RV7 fuse
--- In RV7and7A@yahoogroups.com, "Dan Checkoway" <dan@r...> wrote:
> Call Genuine Aircraft Hardware Company:
> http://www.gen-aircraft-hardware.com They stock all sorts of stuff.
>
> Here's another one:
> http://www.aerocraftparts.com/ItemForm.aspx?item=MD46-16MAU
> (cheaper than Spruce, I think)
>
> Does Van's have a source? Since they stock the MD36, maybe they
can source
> the MD46.
>
> Or just get the MD46-15, which Spruce does seem to stock, and use an
> additional washer?
>
> Or just wait until Spruce has the right part in stock...not like
you'll be
> flying within the next few weeks anyway, I assume.
>
> You have options...and probably lots of other stuff to work on in
the
> meantime. Keep cranking, you'll be done soon!
>
> )_( Dan
> RV-7 N714D (558 hours)
> http://www.rvproject.com
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
www.vansaircraft.net
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