Author: "lucky macy" <luckymacy@...> Time: Thu Mar 4, 2004 3:46 am PST Link
I have an IO-360-A1B6D from a Mooney. The markings on the FI servo said
Bendix RSA-SAD1
Precision Air Motor Corp FC MAB
I don't have any Lycoming/Mooney documentation with the engine. I will get
an overhaul manual but I doubt it will tell me this question. Any idea if a
fuel return line was used on the Mooney?
Even if it wasn't used on the Mooney, would it ever a *bad* concept to
implement on a RV?
Does the return need to go to a fuel tank or just Teed back to the fuel line
upstream of the fuel selector vavle? My tanks are *done* so I'm hopinig not
to go there.
thanks,
lucky
----Original Message Follows----
From: "David Rogers" <davidrgr@...>
Reply-To: rv8list@yahoogroups.com
To: <rv8list@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: RE: [rv8list] Re: FloScan transducer mounting
Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 21:02:17 -0500
What are the pros/cons of one system over the other ?
Does the Airflow Perf unit give you more HP ?
How does the Bendix system eliminate the need for the fuel return ?
Dave R.
RV-8 (wings)
-----Original Message-----
From: mahlon_r [mailto:mahlon_russell@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 6:42 PM
To: rv8list@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [rv8list] Re: FloScan transducer mounting
Brian,
The Precison/Bendix fuel injection system that comes standard on a
Lycoming IO-360 does not need or use a fuel return. If on the other
hand, you are going to use a AirFlow performance fuel injection
system the fuel return is required.
Good Luck,
Mahlon
-- In rv8list@yahoogroups.com, "bcross2160rv8" <BCROSS2160@R...>
wrote:
> Hi Folks
>
> On this subject, I have been trying to figure out for awhile what
> type of fuel valve do I require.
>
> I plan to use an IO360 with the Andair fuel valve. What I do not
know
> is if I need to get the expensive one which returns a portion of
the
> fuel to the tank selected? I assume that in the injected models,
> some of the fuel has to be returned to tank to keep the fuel cool.
I
> am obviously over my head on this one & would really appreciate
some
> advice on this.
>
> Thanks very much.
>
> Brian #81844
> -- In rv8list@yahoogroups.com, "Danny King" <danny.king@c...> wrote:
> > Guys,
> > I saw a flying RV-8 the other day with all of the fuel components
> hanging on the firewall or motor mount. I ask him if he was having
> any weird fuel pressure readings. He said that his fuel pressure
> readings were all over the place. He had an angle valve I0360 200
hp
> engine. I couldn't help but flash back to my first homebuilt. It
> was a Pitts S1S with a PS-5C pressure carb and Christen Inverted
> system. I mounted the Pitts electric Airborne boast pump on the
> firewall along with the gascolator. All was well after that first
> flight on December 15, 1983 but by the late spring of 1984 I got a
> real scare when the fuel pressure started to drop. The Bendix PS-
5C
> requires approx. 14 psi to work. It is kinda like a throttle body
> injection (part carburetor and part fuel injection). I found that
> the Texas heat, and having those fuel components on the firewall
side
> was incompatible! I replumbed the Pitts and moved all fuel
> components to cockpit side of the firewall. All my problems went
> away!
> >
> > When planning the Doll's fuel system, I took the lessons learned
> and followed the very simple Grumman AA1 setup. The Grumman AA-
1A
> I owned for 23 years DID NOT HAVE A GASCOLATOR. In fact it used a
> tank drains at the low point just like the RV-8. If you drain your
> tanks prior to the first flight, then there will be no water in the
> system.
> > Second, if all fuel system plumbing is behind the firewall, there
> will be no vapor lock (fuel boiling) problems. The Doll is set up
> this way. After the (through the firewall) fitting, there is a 303
> hose to the engine fuel pump, and the rest is the way Lycoming
ships
> the engine to you!
> >
> > I also had a fuel flow transducer in my Grumman AA1-A. It was
> mounted just after the fuel valve, and it work perfectly! So I put
> the transducer in the Doll right after the elbow fitting coming out
> of the bottom of the fuel valve. Nearly 400 hours later, you
guessed
> it... it works perfectly! When I refuel, the total fuel to refill
> the Doll, and the amount used on the Electronics International fuel
> computer are within 1/10 of a gal.
> >
> > I decided to aim the vent line tubes strait down, and I did not
> turn them into the slip stream. I cut them off at an angle to
cause
> some pressurization. I thought about the bug issue as well.
> >
> > I'm not an engineer, and I am not saying that I did it the best
> way. Therefore, I only offer this as a away that I have found to
be
> successful on my former Grumman AA1-A, Pitts S1S, and the Doll.
> >
> > Danny King
> > Beautiful Doll 80434
> > ===========================
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Jross10612@a...
> > To: rv8list@yahoogroups.com
> > Cc: chaskuss@y...
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 7:32 AM
> > Subject: [rv8list] FloScan transducer mounting
> > Charlie:
> >
> > I have my FloScan transducer mounted between the fuel injector
> servo and the
> > distribution block. It is mounted on a small plate that I made;
> that plate
> > meets at two tubes in the engine mount and is attached by two
> Adel clamps.
> > Flexible hose (firesleeved) is used to run in and out of the
> transducer, with
> > straight fittings on the transducer itself. There is a gently
> curved fitting on the
> > flexible hose on the outlet side. I have a blast tube pointed
at
> the
> > transducer, which runs to the top rear engine baffle. Between
the
> engine mounts, Adel
> > clamp rubber and flexible fuel lines, I think I have the
> vibration problem
> > under control. The cooling should be a non issue because of the
> blast tube. (At
> > least when there is airflow when moving)
> >
> > There really is no place to put the FloScan transducer which
> meets all
> > concerns we can think of. Talk to Don Rivera at Airflow
> Performance and he will tell
> > you not to install one at all; he is just too concerned about
> bubbles and
> > cavitation.
> >
> > I have tried to pick a place to mount the transducer that meets
> all
> > requirements as best as possible. I fully agree with your
> comments about the thermal
> > concerns of a transducer that is made of several materials, but
> I've tried to
> > minimize that issue as best that I can. The blast tube in the
> photo of the
> > installation is not seen well in the photo due to the engine
lord
> mount.
> > Anyway, roll your own and don't go too crazy trying to engineer
> every issue
> > into a solution that considers everything.
> >
> > I have a wing root mounted gascolator. I'm thinking about
> removing it because
> > it may be of dubious value. All of the plumbing and potential
for
> leaks may
> > well negate the benefit of the gascolator. But old ideas die
> hard, and the
> > gascolator is a place for filtration and for water to settle
out
> as fuel passes
> > through it. But then all of the turns in the tubing, gentle as
> they are may be a
> > place for fuel turbulence to start. I'll probably leave it in
> because of the
> > filter in the gascolator and he fact that I have not installed
> any other
> > filter. On the other hand Danny King (as well as others) have
> been operating just
> > fine without a gascolator.
> >
> > My point is that if you talk to a fuel system engineer (like
> Caesar Gonazales
> > of Cessna fame) and follow all of the engineering principles
and
> accepted
> > practices when designing a fuel system you will end up with a
> compromise
> > somewhere. One of the things about the RV airplanes is the
poorly
> designed fuel vent
> > system. It's a major no-no to use 1/4 " fuel vent lines simply
> because a single
> > drop of water may freeze in the vent line and cause fuel flow
> problems.
> > Couple this with the fuel vents facing forward into the
> slipstream on the RV-8 and
> > you have a real potential for fuel vent icing if you were to
fly
> into any
> > freezing rain. Or maybe even bugs on a hot day could obstruct
the
> fuel vent. But
> > then the RV-8 was intended to be a VFR sport plane and not to
be
> flown IFR.
> >
> > If I had it to do over I'd put 3/8" fuel vent lines in my
> airplane. Why Van
> > did not do this in the first place is puzzling. On the other
> hand, we don't
> > seem to hear about fuel vent problems on the RV airplanes
either.
> >
> > Anyway, just food for thought.
> >
> > Jon Ross
> > 80094 Wing Paint
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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