Author: "Matthew" <matthew@...> Time: Mon Dec 13, 2004 1:39 pm PST Link
Have you flyers out there had trouble with the U-810/808 wheel pant
brackets cracking?? Attaway Air sells steel versions of these parts
and I'm curious if there really is a problem with these cracking
after awhile. If so, I think I'll just go ahead and order a set but
at $90, I want to make sure I really need them.
Matthew Brandes,
Van's RV-9A (Finish Kit)
EAA Chapter 868/91/1329
www.n523rv.com
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Author: "Richard & Roberta Hegy" <rhegy@...> Time: Mon Dec 13, 2004 9:17 pm PST Link
I'm sure they are better than the AL brackets, but after 90 hrs my AL ones are still OK. You can always replace them during an annual.
Roberta
----- Original Message -----
From: Matthew
To: vansairforce@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 3:21 PM
Subject: [VAF Mailing List] Wheel pant brackets cracking?
Have you flyers out there had trouble with the U-810/808 wheel pant
brackets cracking?? Attaway Air sells steel versions of these parts
and I'm curious if there really is a problem with these cracking
after awhile. If so, I think I'll just go ahead and order a set but
at $90, I want to make sure I really need them.
Matthew Brandes,
Van's RV-9A (Finish Kit)
EAA Chapter 868/91/1329
www.n523rv.com
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Author: "SteinAir, Inc." <flyboyyy@...> Time: Tue Dec 14, 2004 3:09 am PST Link
It seems to depend on how much you abuse your pants! I fly off of
bumpy/lumpy grass, and sometimes dirt, gravel, or gravel roads and
mine cracked at about 100 (couple months) hrs. Also, another good
way to ruin them is to fly without the pants in fairly deep snow--
they get bent all to heck!
I now have a set of Robbies and can vouch for him and his products.
Top Notch!
Now, if you're always flying off of pavement and your pants never
take a beating, they'll probably last just fine.
Cheers,
Stein
--- In vansairforce@yahoogroups.com, "Richard & Roberta Hegy"
<rhegy@w...> wrote:
>
> I'm sure they are better than the AL brackets, but after 90 hrs my
AL ones are still OK. You can always replace them during an annual.
>
> Roberta
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Matthew
> To: vansairforce@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 3:21 PM
> Subject: [VAF Mailing List] Wheel pant brackets cracking?
> Have you flyers out there had trouble with the U-810/808 wheel
pant
> brackets cracking?? Attaway Air sells steel versions of these
parts
> and I'm curious if there really is a problem with these cracking
> after awhile. If so, I think I'll just go ahead and order a set
but
> at $90, I want to make sure I really need them.
>
> Matthew Brandes,
> Van's RV-9A (Finish Kit)
> EAA Chapter 868/91/1329
> www.n523rv.com
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Author: JL <arg1@...> Time: Tue Dec 14, 2004 3:11 am PST Link
400 hrs and on my second set of brackets. These have been on for about
150hrs and showed no cracking last annual.
I do think if they need replacement I'd go with steel next time around.
Turf runway.
Jim
Richard & Roberta Hegy wrote:
> I'm sure they are better than the AL brackets, but after 90 hrs my AL
> ones are still OK. You can always replace them during an annual.
>
> Roberta
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Matthew
> To: vansairforce@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 3:21 PM
> Subject: [VAF Mailing List] Wheel pant brackets cracking?
> Have you flyers out there had trouble with the U-810/808 wheel pant
> brackets cracking?? Attaway Air sells steel versions of these parts
> and I'm curious if there really is a problem with these cracking
> after awhile. If so, I think I'll just go ahead and order a set but
> at $90, I want to make sure I really need them.
>
> Matthew Brandes,
> Van's RV-9A (Finish Kit)
> EAA Chapter 868/91/1329
> www.n523rv.com
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Author: "Cary Rhodes" <rhodeseng@...> Time: Tue Dec 14, 2004 5:22 am PST Link
been flying since spring.
The brackett is still fine flying from grass strip.
The wheel pants cracked around the attachments. I built up some alum
stiffeners within a fiberglass layup. They have been OK for a while.
The brithches leg attachments have broken off also. The 'standard'
attachment routine is only marginal. Haven't decided how I going to
fix it yet.
cary rhodes
--- In vansairforce@yahoogroups.com, "Richard & Roberta Hegy"
<rhegy@w...> wrote:
>
> I'm sure they are better than the AL brackets, but after 90 hrs my
AL ones are still OK. You can always replace them during an annual.
>
> Roberta
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Matthew
> To: vansairforce@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 3:21 PM
> Subject: [VAF Mailing List] Wheel pant brackets cracking?
> Have you flyers out there had trouble with the U-810/808 wheel
pant
> brackets cracking?? Attaway Air sells steel versions of these
parts
> and I'm curious if there really is a problem with these cracking
> after awhile. If so, I think I'll just go ahead and order a set
but
> at $90, I want to make sure I really need them.
>
> Matthew Brandes,
> Van's RV-9A (Finish Kit)
> EAA Chapter 868/91/1329
> www.n523rv.com
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Author: Gregory Bitzer <gbitzer@...> Time: Tue Dec 14, 2004 9:37 am PST Link
fellow turf pilots,
make sure that you're inspecting the welds where the gear leg sleeves
attaches to the motor mount (tail wheel setup). I discovered cracks in the
bottom outside welds on both sides. They were a little tough to detect
under the powder coating. I have spoken with Van's and they indicate that
this is common on tail wheel models that operate from grass. This is
especially true in Britain where the fields tend to be rough.
I am preparing to have the welds fixed by a very capable welder /
fabricator / aircraft builder at Gwinnett Co. Airport (LZU).
Just remember that if your wheel pants are failing then you can be sure
that all of that vibration and stress is being transmitted up into the welds.
My cracks began appearing at around 450 hours operating off a fairly smooth
turf runway (and of course every landing is a "greaser").
Check these welds carefully each time the cowl is off. If those welds fail
you'll be in for a big surprise.
Greg
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Author: "SteinAir, Inc." <flyboyyy@...> Time: Tue Dec 14, 2004 11:03 am PST Link
Good point,
A local RV6 pilot friend of mine was recently doing his annual on
his plane (Taildragger) and found EXACTLY what you describe. He had
cracks on both sides of the engine mount in the location you
describe.
No, he's not a bad pilot, this is his 2nd RV6 and he has a LOT of
hours in the plane, but he does fly off of grass too.
Just an FYI...I'll keep a close watch on mine.
Cheers,
Stein.
--- In vansairforce@yahoogroups.com, Gregory Bitzer <gbitzer@c...>
wrote:
>
> fellow turf pilots,
>
> make sure that you're inspecting the welds where the gear leg
sleeves
> attaches to the motor mount (tail wheel setup). I discovered
cracks in the
> bottom outside welds on both sides. They were a little tough to
detect
> under the powder coating. I have spoken with Van's and they
indicate that
> this is common on tail wheel models that operate from grass. This
is
> especially true in Britain where the fields tend to be rough.
>
> I am preparing to have the welds fixed by a very capable welder /
> fabricator / aircraft builder at Gwinnett Co. Airport (LZU).
> Just remember that if your wheel pants are failing then you can be
sure
> that all of that vibration and stress is being transmitted up into
the welds.
> My cracks began appearing at around 450 hours operating off a
fairly smooth
> turf runway (and of course every landing is a "greaser").
> Check these welds carefully each time the cowl is off. If those
welds fail
> you'll be in for a big surprise.
>
> Greg
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Author: "steve zicree" <szicree@...> Time: Tue Dec 14, 2004 11:35 am PST Link
I recently received my RV4 finish kit and noticed that the engine mount was unpainted. I have seen many folks on here refer to a powder coated mount. When I posted a question about it, the only response I got was that I should count myself lucky, as the powder coat is not so great. I plan on using some epoxy primer and a couple of light coats of auto paint. The reason I mention it is that powder coating is usually quite thick and would make crack detection difficult. A nice thin coat of white paint seems a better idea, especially in light of these reported cracks.
Steve Zicree.
----- Original Message -----
From: SteinAir, Inc.
To: vansairforce@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2004 10:45 AM
Subject: Re: [VAF Mailing List] Wheel pant brackets cracking?
Good point,
A local RV6 pilot friend of mine was recently doing his annual on
his plane (Taildragger) and found EXACTLY what you describe. He had
cracks on both sides of the engine mount in the location you
describe.
No, he's not a bad pilot, this is his 2nd RV6 and he has a LOT of
hours in the plane, but he does fly off of grass too.
Just an FYI...I'll keep a close watch on mine.
Cheers,
Stein.
--- In vansairforce@yahoogroups.com, Gregory Bitzer <gbitzer@c...>
wrote:
>
> fellow turf pilots,
>
> make sure that you're inspecting the welds where the gear leg
sleeves
> attaches to the motor mount (tail wheel setup). I discovered
cracks in the
> bottom outside welds on both sides. They were a little tough to
detect
> under the powder coating. I have spoken with Van's and they
indicate that
> this is common on tail wheel models that operate from grass. This
is
> especially true in Britain where the fields tend to be rough.
>
> I am preparing to have the welds fixed by a very capable welder /
> fabricator / aircraft builder at Gwinnett Co. Airport (LZU).
> Just remember that if your wheel pants are failing then you can be
sure
> that all of that vibration and stress is being transmitted up into
the welds.
> My cracks began appearing at around 450 hours operating off a
fairly smooth
> turf runway (and of course every landing is a "greaser").
> Check these welds carefully each time the cowl is off. If those
welds fail
> you'll be in for a big surprise.
>
> Greg
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Author: R Y <cvn_21@...> Time: Tue Dec 14, 2004 4:51 pm PST Link
Hello-
I've noticed that the wheels on many RV's occassionally shake excessively (alarmingly, actually) during taxi. This usually occurs to the main gear wheel and strut, on tail draggers, as an exaggerated response to rolling over a tiny pit hole or section boundry on a cement or asphalt taxiway. It reminds me of a bad nose wheel shimmie on a 172, but I assume the RV pilot can't feel it due to the absence of a steerable nose wheel. To the casual observer, or would-be purchaser, it appears that the main gear strut on RV's is either too flexible or too weak. I was wondering if my observation and conclusion is correct. Thank you.
Ron
Gregory Bitzer <gbitzer@cisco.com> wrote:
fellow turf pilots,
make sure that you're inspecting the welds where the gear leg sleeves
attaches to the motor mount (tail wheel setup). I discovered cracks in the
bottom outside welds on both sides. They were a little tough to detect
under the powder coating. I have spoken with Van's and they indicate that
this is common on tail wheel models that operate from grass. This is
especially true in Britain where the fields tend to be rough.
I am preparing to have the welds fixed by a very capable welder /
fabricator / aircraft builder at Gwinnett Co. Airport (LZU).
Just remember that if your wheel pants are failing then you can be sure
that all of that vibration and stress is being transmitted up into the welds.
My cracks began appearing at around 450 hours operating off a fairly smooth
turf runway (and of course every landing is a "greaser").
Check these welds carefully each time the cowl is off. If those welds fail
you'll be in for a big surprise.
Greg
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Author: "Kyle Boatright" <kboatright1@...> Time: Tue Dec 14, 2004 6:08 pm PST Link
Shimmey is a fairly common problem with tailgear RV's. It is quite noticable when it happens. Balanced tires help, as does reduced air pressure. Per another builder's suggestion, I balanced my wheelpants along the wheel axle line, but I still get shimmy. My airplane does not have the stiffeners that Van's mentions in the plans.
KB
----- Original Message -----
From: R Y
To: vansairforce@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2004 6:29 PM
Subject: Re: [VAF Mailing List] Wheel pant brackets cracking?
Hello-
I've noticed that the wheels on many RV's occassionally shake excessively (alarmingly, actually) during taxi. This usually occurs to the main gear wheel and strut, on tail draggers, as an exaggerated response to rolling over a tiny pit hole or section boundry on a cement or asphalt taxiway. It reminds me of a bad nose wheel shimmie on a 172, but I assume the RV pilot can't feel it due to the absence of a steerable nose wheel. To the casual observer, or would-be purchaser, it appears that the main gear strut on RV's is either too flexible or too weak. I was wondering if my observation and conclusion is correct. Thank you.
Ron
Gregory Bitzer <gbitzer@cisco.com> wrote:
fellow turf pilots,
make sure that you're inspecting the welds where the gear leg sleeves
attaches to the motor mount (tail wheel setup). I discovered cracks in the
bottom outside welds on both sides. They were a little tough to detect
under the powder coating. I have spoken with Van's and they indicate that
this is common on tail wheel models that operate from grass. This is
especially true in Britain where the fields tend to be rough.
I am preparing to have the welds fixed by a very capable welder /
fabricator / aircraft builder at Gwinnett Co. Airport (LZU).
Just remember that if your wheel pants are failing then you can be sure
that all of that vibration and stress is being transmitted up into the welds.
My cracks began appearing at around 450 hours operating off a fairly smooth
turf runway (and of course every landing is a "greaser").
Check these welds carefully each time the cowl is off. If those welds fail
you'll be in for a big surprise.
Greg
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Author: Sam Buchanan <sbuc@...> Time: Tue Dec 14, 2004 6:08 pm PST Link
R Y wrote:
>
> Hello-
>
> I've noticed that the wheels on many RV's occassionally shake
> excessively (alarmingly, actually) during taxi. This usually occurs
> to the main gear wheel and strut, on tail draggers, as an exaggerated
> response to rolling over a tiny pit hole or section boundry on a
> cement or asphalt taxiway. It reminds me of a bad nose wheel shimmie
> on a 172, but I assume the RV pilot can't feel it due to the absence
> of a steerable nose wheel. To the casual observer, or would-be
> purchaser, it appears that the main gear strut on RV's is either too
> flexible or too weak. I was wondering if my observation and
> conclusion is correct. Thank you.
>
> Ron
Ron, your observation is sorta correct. :-)
No doubt the gear flexing you have observed can be caused or aggravated
by the tire running over imperfections in the taxiway, but it seems the
main reason for the flexing is due to the friction characteristics of
the tires we use (ok....I know that won't hold up for the engineers on
the list....please help me out on the tire mechanics here.....!!). The
reason I say this is that flexing can occur on an extremely smooth
surface and the speed at which the flexing occurs depends on the tire
air pressure. The higher the pressure, the higher the speed where
flexing will occur and the more likely the osccilations will occur. That
is a prime reason why most pilots of conventional-geared RV's run
pressures that are way "too low", often in the 24lb range. This inhibits
the flexing and often moves it to a speed range below normal taxi speeds.
And yes, the pilot is *very* aware of when the shaking begins! :-)
The gear struts are neither too flexible nor too weak. Flexibility is
essential since there is no other mechanism for absorbing landing
shocks. It can be somewhat disconcerting for the uniformed observer to
witness, but it is safe (though sometimes irritating) and has been a
part of RV-4's and -6's since day one. The only gear failures on
conventional-geared RV's have been the result of landing the plane
several feet *below* the runway. :-)
Sam Buchanan (RV-6)
http://thervjournal.com
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Author: JL <arg1@...> Time: Wed Dec 15, 2004 3:38 am PST Link
My -4 has one taxi speed that seems to encourage that harmonic
twitching- I do not have those wooden dampeners/stiffiners installed,
either. I taxi just a little slower or faster than that dancing speed.
Kyle Boatright wrote:
> Shimmey is a fairly common problem with tailgear RV's. It is quite
> noticable when it happens. Balanced tires help, as does reduced air
> pressure. Per another builder's suggestion, I balanced my wheelpants
> along the wheel axle line, but I still get shimmy. My airplane does
> not have the stiffeners that Van's mentions in the plans.
>
> KB
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: R Y
> To: vansairforce@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2004 6:29 PM
> Subject: Re: [VAF Mailing List] Wheel pant brackets cracking?
> Hello-
>
> I've noticed that the wheels on many RV's occassionally shake
> excessively (alarmingly, actually) during taxi. This usually occurs to
> the main gear wheel and strut, on tail draggers, as an exaggerated
> response to rolling over a tiny pit hole or section boundry on a
> cement or asphalt taxiway. It reminds me of a bad nose wheel shimmie
> on a 172, but I assume the RV pilot can't feel it due to the absence
> of a steerable nose wheel. To the casual observer, or would-be
> purchaser, it appears that the main gear strut on RV's is either too
> flexible or too weak. I was wondering if my observation and conclusion
> is correct. Thank you.
>
> Ron
>
> Gregory Bitzer <gbitzer@cisco.com> wrote:
>
> fellow turf pilots,
>
> make sure that you're inspecting the welds where the gear leg sleeves
> attaches to the motor mount (tail wheel setup). I discovered cracks
> in the
> bottom outside welds on both sides. They were a little tough to detect
> under the powder coating. I have spoken with Van's and they indicate
> that
> this is common on tail wheel models that operate from grass. This is
> especially true in Britain where the fields tend to be rough.
>
> I am preparing to have the welds fixed by a very capable welder /
> fabricator / aircraft builder at Gwinnett Co. Airport (LZU).
> Just remember that if your wheel pants are failing then you can be sure
> that all of that vibration and stress is being transmitted up into
> the welds.
> My cracks began appearing at around 450 hours operating off a fairly
> smooth
> turf runway (and of course every landing is a "greaser").
> Check these welds carefully each time the cowl is off. If those
> welds fail
> you'll be in for a big surprise.
>
> Greg
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